Griffin, SIN, and reality
>Thank you for your note. My replies below aren't meant to argue
>your good points, just thinking through the situation.
You would likely have to have several reports involving big money wagering, or affiliation with a bj team, to make it into the book.
>First, that is what I thought, and part of the reason I was agressive,
> playing without camouflage at the place that eventually barred me.
> When I was in Vegas last time, I read the book "A Card Counter's
> Guide to Casino Surveilance" -- an amazing read.
> And it said that a lot
> more people get in the books than one might suspect, and many of
> them are just recreational players that got noted by overzealous
> non-Nevada casinos (the sort of place that barred me). The book
> also said though that Griffin tends not to put you in without at
> least two notifications or video-tape evidence. On this point it
> was a little vague about the difference between Griffin and SIN.
And if you were in, it would not cause anyone to notice immediately upon putting your name into the computer.
> So if a casino subscribes to the service, they don't do an automatic
> check on new names that come in? I probably would if I were
> in their shoes.
The truth is that simply taking insurance with a max bet out is more likely to get you in trouble than being in the Griffin book. It is generally consulted only after the casino is very suspicious of you already. On the other hand, if you get put out on a SIN flyer then you might get noticed immediately. This usually only has an impact if you had trouble at casinos in the immediate area very recently.
> That SIN scenario might actually apply.
The "possible professional" you heard was probably your imagination. The counter-measures were probably the result of observation of your play.
> I think it may well be my imagination too. But I do have good
> peripheral hearing, and a few times at the place that barred me
> I thought I heard the pit talking about me, but dismissed it as
> imagination caused by over-estimation of my own abilities. I also
> saw the standard measures described in the books -- a phone call,
> and a glance. Two guys, one definitely a casino employee, standing
> outside the pit staring at my play, two times. Once they were so
> obvious two other players at my table talked about them -- what are
> those guys looking at?...
> So when they surprisingly to me barred me, I figured I probably
> heard corectly. The second time I used no id and played only after
> I noted a new pit person, and no one else that knew me. Within about
> 10 minutes, a senior manager replaced the pit guy, and another
> manager together with a security guy loudly called my first name and
> walked me to the cahiers cage.
And any advice for a rookie player who managed to get himself
in the book so quickly?
It it was true then I'd say to keep up the good work. It takes strong, aggressive play to stay ahead over the long term... the same thing it takes to get into the book. The best defense after you are in is to use lots of different names and play lots of different areas.
> When I go to a new casino, and the pit pressures me to get a player
> card -- If I give them a business card rather than a drivers license,
> will that be accepted, or will that in itself engender suspicion?
> Is the only way to actually check Griffin or SIN to go through a
> casino employee?
When you've been kicked out everywhere, start back at the beginning with new names and do it again.