Dont forget to tip your dealers.

sure tips make happy dealers but there are many places where tips are small and few between and the house still has table games. The house makes the money instead of that money being tipped. Housed like these are common. Do you think a cheap Gaughan property cares about dealers tips, Nope. They get whatever dealers they can get, usually breakin dealers and the tips they get at these places are minimal. If you asked Mr. Gaughan whether he feels bad for getting money from cheap and poor people rather than more going to tips I am sure he would be lying if he said "they should have tipped more". It is more money in his companies coffers bottome line. That is how these cheap joints run. Sure Mandalay Bay probably encourages you to bet for their dealers but if the world were truly to cheapen and not tip (unrealistic assumption but for the sake of argument) Mandalay Bay would soon look like the El Cortez. Table games would exist and conditions would not necessarily suffer, just everything would be cheaper. The house would have made the money and not the dealers and cheap clientele would be the norm. A sad world indeed but I disagree that table games would be eliminated. There are many people willing to work for $5-7 base pay with small tips. Especially a skill that anybody can do with minimal training such as being a blackjack dealer. As a side note I actually tip more at the slum joints than at places like the bellagio. I feel the dealers are more deserving of extra tokes. There is no reason a dealer at the el cortez should get paid significantly less than one at the bellagio for doing the same job but that is the way it is in this world. There are some exceptions such as inexperience and incompetence but I find that these factors tend to be present at both the slum joints and the high roller places.

Cutter

It may be true that some dealers will work for minimum wages at these cheap,selfish and greedy joints, but look at the price these casinos will pay in the long run.

1. The constant pain in the ass of hiring and training new dealers due to a high turn over.
2. The constant pain in the ass of catching, controlling and settling up dealer mistakes and disputes at the tables due to inexperienced dealers.
As you know 99% of dealer mistakes benefit "us" not the casino. ..in return causing a turning the tables AGAINST the casino as they lose money while trying to provoke a "NO TIPPING" joint in order to increase the casinos bottom line...a sure loser.
3. The lack of pride and self esteem with dealers toward their job that may reflect an attitude problem toward the players also.

I must say it is enjoyable to gamble at these few casinos. Many of the inexperienced dealers sweat out every round of play and if I hang around long enough I'm very apt to ironically receive a few generous tips for myself that is greatly appreciated.

Mott

The cheap joints depend on it to get half-way trainable and competent dealers. You get what you pay for ( in terms of quality ) even with the help you hire. This is another reason why I hate Gaughan properties because they depend on the upward mobility provided by other casinos within the buisness to get decent help of their own.

Believe me, if the job payed 6 or 7 bucks an hour FOR A CAREER no one with an IQ above 80 would be interested. Of course people with an IQ of 80 wouldn't be able to deal the game either, or would be so cost " ineffective " that the game would become a losing proposition for the casino.

I think Motts right, mulah drives the whole ship from bow to stern and if you don't pay the slaves in the galleys their proper due they'll either mutiny or set the whole stinkin boat on fire.

Vegas locals are like Caribbean natives - all they see when they look at out-of-towners is $$ signs. I'm not sure who I dislike like more - Vegas cab drivers or Vegas dealers- they're both hustlers.

Anyone who has made decent money at this game (obviously not yourself), has concluded that in only rare cases will tipping result in greater EV. Leave tipping to the fish, god knows there's enough of you. I'm glad you guys are around feeding money to the casinos so I can take it out.

In recent years, Hard Rock has had the highest toke rate/ Bellagio next. Before they opened, Caesars was at the top (they've supposedly fallen off quite a bit recently - no surprise when you look at how they've ruined the property and are no longer competitive with Bellagio, MGM, Venetian, etc. catering to the big players). DI, LV Hilton, Mirage, and maybe MGM were considered the other good-paying gigs back then.

I like your new handle name, stick with it so I'll know which post to read...or not to read.

With your attitude of "no tipping" you're bound to come across some very shrewd games...as I know( but you evidently dont know) a dealer can make this game of blackjack turn into very difficult conditions..,,no wonder you think dealers are jerks.

You have an image in your head that I'm implying "If you tip, your EV will increase." Where have I said this?
All that I ask is for an ordinary game with good (or regular)conditions. I suppose you have not been in the scene long enough to wittness or understand just exactly what were talkin' about?

at a shoe game with a slotted cut card say. Even in games where pen is dealer dependent, assuming that a dealer will worsen pen for you gives them far too much credit. The reason they deal is because stuff like that is beyond them.

If you are having trouble keeping up with dealers or getting your bets out in time, you have a long way to go in this game. Also, on close calls, you will win your argument 80% of the time or so with the pit if the dealer screws up. In fact, it is probably a positive EV play to have the dealer upset with you.

FWIW (and it doesn't mean much to me) there is no need to have an antagonistic relationship with a dealer just because you don't tip and I rarely do.

The fact that I automatically associate all actions in a casino including tipping with EV and you don't shows the difference in our level of play.

If I ran a casino, I would welcome you in .

Now you're trying to throw me a curve by pitching a slot cut card and claim your EV increases when you piss dealers off!? ya' think?

There are tactics dealers can use that will make conditions annoying and I dont need to disscuss them with you or anyone else.

in tokes at the first joint I ever worked, Poker Palace in North Vegas!! Moved on after 1 week, to $50/day tips at Vacation Village.... However, there IS a significant reason dealers do and SHOULD get paid less at EC vs Bellagio. They are BEGINNERS, for the most part. Name any trade where apprentices make as much as journeymen.....

posting on this site seem to prefer single or double deck games. As a counter myself, I have preferentially shuffled up on many none tippers, and REALLY had a good laugh when they put out larger bets in bad counts thinking THAT was what would trigger a pref shuffle. Shoe games can get .5-1 extra decks pen, one way or another...Not all dealers are as unintelligent as you would like to think...

We are in total agreement. :-)

I'd be willing to bet that the non-tippers are the same ones who make posts such as, "I got backed off at [insert casino] and I was only spreading 1-4!"

I am not saying that tipping will eliminate back-offs, but the fact remains that a lot of counters have the same attitude as Det. White, and most non-counters don't.

Toked dealers are more likely to be happy dealers. Happy dealers make for happy pit critters. A pit critter is less likely to back someone off who is making his dealers happy. Or at the very least, not pissing them off.

Furthermore, many pit critters tend to be more generous when estimating your average bet if they see a toke now and then.

I have gotten a lot of longevity in a lot of places simply by figuring out how the typical counter acts . . . and not acting that way.

A footnote: Anyone who thinks dealers cannot manipulate pen via those cut-card slots at the MGM/Mirage properties has obviously not played them very much.

And there are a near-infinite number of things a dealer can do to make a conters life miserable, if he/she is so inclined.

I might also add that I very rarely get pref-shuffled.

that these journeyman dealers acquire over experience is not worth the increase in skill level. I prefer a friendly but competent humble dealer, give me a dealer at the EC anyday for my casino. This is definitely an opinion but I find that the higher class the hotel is the worse the attitude problems the dealers have. Some think that since they have been dealing for 20 years they have artistic license to do things there way instead of the house way. This stuff is not tolerated in other industries and the casino industry is no different.

Cutter

The world's oldest profession.

I am the champion of playing break-even blackjack in all of my spare time and enjoying my coffeechop comps to places like Horseshoe. I get backed off once a year or so/ wonder why not more often? When I'm not playing break -even BJ, I enjoy shoving my nose up the ass of any recognized BJ expert on these pages.

Virtually no dealer can make a counter or no what to do with one. If they do , they become pit bosses. And believe me, bosses are only a small step above the average small animal in intelligence. Where do you think that puts the average dealer?

what do you make - 30K/ year. Or did you just get the big raise to 40K? You couldn't recognize a real pro if he hit you in the face. Your hands would be trembling too hard as you handled the purple and yellow chips (if the dive you work in even has yellow chips).

Of course people with an IQ of 80 wouldn't be able to deal the game either, or would be so cost " ineffective " that the game would become a losing proposition for the casino.
---------

This is so so true. 'Intelligence' counts far more than mere 'cunning'.

Was playing at a $100 min. table. Was dealt a push and the dealer paid me. Ten to fifteen minutes later I was tapped on the shoulder.
I was then informed that the "camera from above" caught a dealer error
and that I should now pay the dealer. I did, and was later informed
that they could have ejected me (and possibly arrested me for fraud) had I not done so.
It was a first for me. Any one else experienced this?

The BJ experts get ALL the perks!

"When I'm not playing break -even BJ, I enjoy shoving my nose up the ass of any recognized BJ expert on these pages." - Detective White

Reality is, that giving that tip does absolutly nothing for you. You may make a dealer happy. And if you feel in your heart that it's changing something, then go for it. But, it is changing NOTHING. As long as they are taking the cards out of the shoe and not out of there sleeve or pocket. I wouldn't worry about it. It is purely a personal thing. Some people think it makes the dealer with them. Then your counting on the gambling gods. That dealer has nothing at all to do with if you win or lose. It's just a mental thing that alot of players go through. And remember if you're not counting, then your just gambling. Good luck.

you see them getting tipped at ridulous rates like 500 dollars an hour in high limit areas commonly on weekends like at Caesars.