A Bobby Singer's punch to Wong.

I have to admit I get more heat at the tables from the "Master of Flow" idiots than the pit. I believe due to the infamous Master of Flow system being televised in recent years and advertised thru-out North America,,Bobby Singer has created a flocking of Flow Lords that are a true nemesis to me, as these voodoo nutheads try to analyze and atempt to take complete control of the shoe, daring anyone to step in (or out)and mess up their little fantasy. To make matters worse even some selfish lonley card counters will complain also. The game of BJ is already difficult to beat and dealing with the flow nuts is pain in the ass. I have now forced myself to eke-out miserable existence in a play-all approach and have been gambling under the thumb of flowist the past month. What I can tell you is it was a terrible losing mistake. I now know for a fact that most casinos have a no mid-shoe entry to keep the voodoo-children more so than to eliminate wonging.

I try to avoid paper-talk and bring you my own conclusion.
Thanks to Bobby Singer, I now sit at the crossroads.

Mott

MTF isn't about 'flow-of-cards' voodoo, MTF is a simplified HiLo method. G

What meets the prospects eye and appeal from TV in regards to the advertisement is "The FLOW...the winning trend." Many have not acquired the video and assume "The flow is the answer."
The details mean nothing and are not mentioned on TV, however the FLOW is mentioned over and over.

In his original drivel, Bobby Singer acknowledged
Stanford Wong, Arnold Snyder and Donald Schlesinger,
among others. It would seem that you have been caught
in a backwash of unrecognizable bullshit just because
it got chucked out of a different window. It is the
same crap he was shoveling l5 years ago.

Many times that I've played "Play-all" DD, another counter might show up and start cherry-picking the game. By doing this, he's sharing the surplus 10s with me and letting me take all small stuff... he's
essentially using me.

In these cases, I'll either leave the table if there are others or if
I think he'll draw heat onto both of us or... I'll accuse him of messing up the "flow" of the cards and tell him in earshot of the dealer/pit to either play the game or take a hike.

If he stays without heat, I'll have to leave but the pit will often
take my side for the reason you state near the end of your post, Mott.

Spok

Bobby Singer did put out a video tape 15 or so years ago, but the tape was about the hi-lo count and did not mention a floooow of any sort. Then Singer took it a step further several years ago and came up with a gimmic line of "Follow the Flow" as advertised on cable TV.
His flow-crap was further enhanced by the testimonial claims of gamblers winning much $$$ by following the flow.

The flow-gimmic today is far more popular than 15 years ago and is an annoyance that I do recognize has become increasingly popular.

is another man's whirlpool, which is another man's riptide, and yet another man's pool of stagnant quick-sand.

Flux and flow followers need to be hoisted by their own petard by joining them in their foolish/flotsam folly, matey. What you need to do Mott is get ahold of one of Singer's " Master The Flow " books, which presumably has a money back guarantee, and master the flow of slippery words from the Master himself, Singer!

By doing this, you will not only fool the wavering dupes at the tables, but also the stiffened, peg-legged dupes behind them! Surely, they will get sea-sick from all these watery ruminations about when, or when not, to raise your bet ( according to the flow ) and all your blimey mates will look fondly upon you as their El Capitan!

Of course, all the while you'll maintain your mastery over the true compass of your seafaring journey, THE COUNT, yet little will anyone ever guess of the sword wielding venality of your piratic endeavors.

Jeez... all you card counters are beating your brains out trying to eke out a marginal profit at the game and you complain about Bobby Simger. I 'll wager that he is putting more money in the bank than most card counters. Seems to me that he has found a better way to beat the game.

Yep he is selling the same stuff l5 years later, and
guess where he got it?

Yup!

He stopped playing and is selling a system instead.

I've used this twice, now, only when things got HOT. I look the flowbie right in the eye and say "I was hired by the casino to mess up the flow." Both times the effect was salutory. Flowbies left the game (leaving more plus count cards for me) or just started laughing. Once, a player asked a pb "Why'd you hire that guy??" Pb said "I heard YOU hired him!" Laughter from all except the flowbidiot. He was gone. Peace reigned thereafter.

I'm equally likely to use the flow as an excuse to sit out or jump in. It doesn't matter if the cards have been bad or good, flow always makes a good excuse. ;-)

I sure as hell never left a hot shoe due to heat!

ETF

Thanks. I had ignored this whole thread, until I saw your posts. I really had not idea what MTF was. .

Is there a formal system for this strategy. Or is it simply a matter of keeping the same number of boxes in a "good" shoe, and changing them in a "bad" shoe.

I use these techniques a lot myself : ) Maybe I should learn them.

I remember I had a Pit Manager come over and compliment our table "Boy. You guys really know how to play this game. Change the flow of the cards when they are going bad � "

PS: This is a copy of a post I had erroneously put up in a different spot in the thread. I have deleted that post.

Many are convinced that a flow does exist when it is nothing but an illusion. Keeping the same rounds because you are winning or changing rounds because you are losing does not accomplish or prove anything.
If you are a counter, stick to your guns and dont let any flow artist persuade you to join them and the flow.

I know hes a huckster but if it wasnt for him i would have never started down the road to advantage play. When i was a junior in high school i saw his infomercial on blackjack. I didnt buy his system but i learned enough about BJ, dependent trials, BS, simple hi - lo to get me learning more about blackjack. When i walked into a casino when i was 21 i was already a bs expert. Where i lived and my limited bankroll prevented me from being a counter but i kept on reading and kept on learning and now at 31 years of age im an advantage player and im not mastering the flow.That infomercial set me on a chain of events that led me to where i am today; otherwise i may have never even went inside a casino.The basic knowledge he provided 15 years ago helped me be able to recognize junk-John patrick and solid info- wong, thorpe, Schlesinger, Snyder etc.. its quite ironic that Singer started me on the road and a a non BJ author Lund finally took me to the promised land of advantage play.

As I said earlier (play all approach) I've been under the thumb of flowbies... even pretending to be one myself. The problem is I tend to place continuous bets in negative shoes that has exceeded my usual norm and it has cost me. Another words, in order to keep the flowbies happy...I PAY THE PRICE. It is good cover if you are willing to pay for it, but you would be amazed at how devastating this approach will effect the bottom line.