Is it really worth it?

I am currently trying to count blackjack with a 10000 dollar bankroll. I do not have many choices of games worth playing in the area that I live in. There are 10 dollar min tables that are eight decks most closely to where I live. These tables are few and far between and are always full. Is it worth it to even bother to try and make money in these conditions or should I just continue to save my money and play at the 6 deck 25 dollar level even though that will be in the much distant future? Thank you for any suggestions.

Certainly refraining from playing a crowded 8 decker is a good idea, as you are not really funded to play at the $25 level.

Your Risk Of Ruin is rather high with a 10K bankroll. If you spread 12-1 betting GREEN (and that is a rather modest betting ramp) �

� you'd have just 33 big bets. I play green all of the time, but my bankroll is triple yours.

The funny thing about full tables is they tend to lose players when lots of small cards come out: their double downs lose, dealers make their stiffs, etc. Don't underestimate full tables. You may as well practice on the 8 deckers, provided the pen and rules are good, while you wait and build your BR for the 6 deckers. Provided the p3n and rules are good.

On a $10K war-chest, you might be better served to concentrate on Spanish 21 instead of blackjack. But always look for tables that aren't busy and wong, wong, wong!

I played for months solely backcounting and wonging in/out of relatively crappy 8D games (S17 DS pen = 1.7).

You don't say how big the casino(s) are that are close to you but Wonging is quite viable on weekends at most mid-sized casinos.

After you Wong in, if you don't have to Wong back out you can WR the next shoe.

You should be able to get in 2-3 hr sessions this way playing only favorable counts especially at low stakes.

As you build your BR you will be able to play more and more games.

I am in the Detroit area and the MGM 8 decks are about the only ones that are playable. I would only play at the 10 dollar tables with a 10000 dollar bank cause 25 min would be suicidal. I will also only wong in and out of games as well or else it would never be worth it. The reason why I asked the question of whether it would be worth it or not is that the 8 decks just seem to be a brutal machine for the player even when the count is extremely high. Am I just extremely unlucky or is it the norm to lose 1000 bucks in one night. I can replenish this bankroll but I don't know how many times I can lose 1000 dollars in one night without questioning the eight deck games. When I played on a short bankroll on the 6 deck games I was never that unlucky.

No self-respecting AP is ever gonna play shoe games without the surrender rule. I am not being snide, just truthful.

I agree with your overall point and that is why I mainly play at Foxwoods on the East Coast, as opposed to AC. This is my longest time without a trip to LV, but I will play good pen games there if they don't have surrender. I will play sometimes in AC for various reasons. Not being snide (ok, maybe I am a little), but you are wrong. I respect myself and my playing ability and I will play shoe games without surrender. Maybe by your definition I am not an AP so your rule applies to me. Admittedly, I am not a pro but a serious recreational player at the green chip level. I do not "play all" and will wong out when necessary. I rarely backcount.

I hate it when someone makes a blanket post such as this speaking for the entire community by stating what games someone should or shouldn't play. Different people find different value in different games. Why can't you just state that YOU would not choose to play a shoe game without surrender?

I consider myself an AP, in my 7th year of supporting myself solely off blackjack profits and since the majority of my play the first 5+ years took place in AC, I have played plenty of no surrender shoe games. Even now, residing in Vegas pt, I will play shoe games without surrender, if the other rules are good and penetration is better than average. Surrender is nice, but penetration is much more important to me.

MGM Detroit is easy to beat even though its mostly 8D. Dealers and pit or extremely stupid, players even worse. The key to them is the PEN is excellent (7 of 8 dealt). Its best to wong the 6D game early in the day when they are $25, but you can easily beat the 8D with a $10,000 BR on the $10 game or even $15 ones. I am there almost every day and there are always plenty of tables with just a few players. Also, one tip to rid people from the tables, split those dreaded 10's early in the shoe and watch the other players run like they were getting robbed. Also dont forget to double your A8 vs 6 since it is a H17 game. The ploppies love that one too.
Greektown now offers a 2D, H17, DOA, DAS game, not great pen though (55-65% tops).
P.S I took an $8900 hit on the $25, 6D game a year ago at MGM so I know the feeling. Variance sucks.