AP Aptitude Test

As a cooperative effort, I wish we could somehow devise and craft a test that could be taken here on this site. It would provide results immediately as to where the test taker is on AP knowledge level. It would be a scale of sorts that could somewhat define and rate where exactly the participants AP abilities and knowledge are. It would also show the participant where his/her weaknesses are and what they need to improve on in order to get to the next level. Maybe for a start, the test would be reflective of BJ aptitude only.
The test would also automatically answer a lot of the same old questions that the newbies always ask.

Feedback please.

Post your test, and flunk everyone.

Anyone taking a test on a Free site to determine their AP aptitude obviously has very little.

Real players wouldn't bother taking such a test, so the only participants would likely be novice or aspiring players. An accomplished A/P already knows the results judged by the only thing that matters, how much money they've extracted from the casinos over the years and what's in their bank accounts/investment portfolio.

Novice or aspiring players ARE real players who want to learn. That is a lot of what this site is about; learning, training, knowledge assessment and advancement with the game.

Why the need to see where one might 'rank' with other players? It is of no real merit except to pump up one's ego.
The point being made is, advantaged players know where they are with their playing skills. It is based on careful evaluation of their play and the positive EV they have bankrolled as a result of that play.
A true student of the game has already devised his own tests of his abilities and applies those tests at regular intervals to see if adjustments need to be made to their playing methodologies.

C-I

SB,

I recently took two different IQ tests online. On the first test, I got two questions incorrect. I was pissed off about these questions, because I thought the author did not understand what he asked (it involved true-false-neither logic for subset relationships). After that test, I took another online IQ test. When the same type of questions came up on the second exam as the first, I used the incorrect logic from the first test author, and once again (since the second author got it right), those were the only questions I missed in the second IQ test. I wrote an angry letter to the first author asking him to consider the effects of poorly written questions or unreasoned answers.

I have my own experience writing an AP IQ test. A couple of years ago I was trying to learn to write PHP scripts. I threw together an AP IQ test to help me learn PHP. It had a lot of questions that were of questionable value, and vague or incorrect choices for the answers. Even though the design was poor, and the questions were not well thought out, it was clear that experts were getting very high scores and those who were not experts got scores that were much lower. So, it worked. However, the amount of vitriol the exam created made the effort a very unpleasant experience for me. Just like I was with the IQ tests I took, those experts who didn't get perfect scores on my exams were (rightfully) pissed at my own lack of care in designing the AP test.

In case you want to have a look, here is the link -- this may be a model for how NOT to write such an exam:

http://www.cardcounter.com/BJ_IQ/BJIQ.html

I would advise against designing such an exam. You will not please the experts with your exam, they will let you know everything that's wrong with your test. You will never get it right, because there are always subtleties that are deeper than you can imagine. The only value it will have is the value you get from its design and implementation.

With best wishes,

Eliot

There are a lot of questions in that test that are very subjective to interpritation and should be revised. Also, knowing the right answer to many of the questions will not make a player more successful at making money with the game. However, it is a rough start in the direction of my idea. My score is 123 on the test. Given many of the questions will not help me to make more $ with the game, I don't really care to know the right answers.

Most of the experts here scored well above 150 -- I am sure you can find the thread. I just retook the test (I haven't looked at it in a couple of years). It has some questions whose answers are clearly wrong, so a score in the 170's may be "perfect," although the max is 200.

As an example, I said the 5 is the most powerful card in the deck... well it is in the sense that it has the highest EOR, but on the other hand, I'd take an ace any day. If you want to deal with these sorts of issues, go forth and create!

I still think that with some significant effort and combined cooperation from people like yourself, a multiple choice general 50 Q & A quiz could be devised. It would be a nice addition to CC.Com, BJ21 or any other site. I think it will just be a matter of time.

The test certainly doesn't need questions like; "Is Inga beautiful?".

So who's gonna be second to place their foot in the circle? I'm game for a challenge.

Part of any IQ test is cultural awareness of the discipline. For example, 25 years ago the Stanford-Binet test had a question asking if you knew who Amelia Earhart was. Such culturally biased questions have now, for the most part, been excluded from the standard IQ tests. But, in Blackjack, such questions are certainly appropriate. These questions demonstrate that you have read broadly and have general knowledge in the area beyond specific skill based knowledge. I know for certain that most of those who are making big bucks absolutely know what or who Inga is. To me, that is a much more important question than the question about Don Schlesinger (which is very inappropriate).

So, there you have the crux of the debate. What is intelligence? What is skill? What are you really measuring with the test you design? In mathematics, there is some folk wisdom that after you find a proof for a theorem, you need to look at your proof and figure out what you have really proven. The same goes for IQ tests.

My advice, seek the answer to your IQ queries at the tables.

let's just try for kicks to analyze the issue with the use of one possible "Aptitude Quiz" question as is shown below in bold italic.

Eliot - I know you know the answer. You taught it to me. Feedback welcomed from anyone.

Prior to placing an original bet into the circle, the count will certainly play a part in the determination of the proper bet size. Given such, what type of initial bet accuracy will be achieved from the first base position (first player to receive cards)?

A. Best
B. Worst
C. The same as any other position.
D. Second best. Third base is most accurate.

Now we just need 49 more questions to complete one of many possible "Aptitude Quizes".

Just wondering, where would a score of 135 (mine) on your test rank.
Average, below or above?

cheers
MT

Prior to placing an original bet into the circle, the count will certainly play a part in the determination of the proper bet size. Given such, what type of initial bet accuracy will be achieved from the first base position (first player to receive cards)?
A. Best
B. Worst
C. The same as any other position.
D. Second best. Third base is most accurate.

That�s a good example of a question that can be interpreted differently by different people. If I were taking the test, I�d consider answer B because I�d figure the test giver to be thinking on a level that would make that answer correct. I�d figure the test giver to be thinking that first base sees fewer cards before making a decision, compared to later spots.

But if I were the one giving the test, I would grade B as a wrong answer. I consider C to be a better answer than B. First base has to play his hand with less information than will be available to other spots, but that has nothing to do with bet accuracy. No cards are dealt between first base placing a bet and third base placing a bet. All bettors have the same information about the count prior to making an original bet, and thus all positions should be equally accurate in sizing a bet to the count.

But I like answer A the best. The question states that �the count will certainly play a part,� implying that other factors might also play parts. What other factors might affect accuracy of bet size? Occasionally but rarely, the top card is accidentally shown to the players before the bets are placed. Only first base gets to receive an accidentally-exposed top card before making an original bet. Knowing the first card to be dealt to your hand can certainly improve your bet accuracy. That means first base is never worse and occasionally better than the other positions in achieving bet-size accuracy, for answer A.

Stanford Wong

and therfore I revised it and posted it higher on the page.

Forgot to clarify in the question that none of the players had any oportunity to see a flash of any of the first few cards in the pack in order to keep all positions from having an unfair advantage over any other positions.

As for the "other factors", I was thinking of bank roll and cover factors.