Thank you everyone

I had to put this message on a new thread to respond to everyone at once.

Thanks for all the input and comments on the tip discussion. It seems that the people who want to help will and the people who don't, won't. I have noticed myself when I'm in Vegas, a certain attitude from dealers, ESPECIALLY craps dealers. They hustle you for tips and I won't give them a penny. I already had bets on the hardways for the dealers and the stickman taps in and immediately tells me to bet the line for them. That was last dollar they would see from me.

To sum it up though. There are times when the situation calls for it, and times when they absolutely don't.

You have a handle on what this counting thing is all about. Now look at a few books and get the real details. I have found that AP is a long road that moves slow. One day you win $1000. , then next day you lose $950. and are glad that your book shows you up $50. for that weekend. In the books you will find that with all the up's and downs you slowly gain on the house by less than 5%. AP's are in it for the long haul and 10% (keeping in mind the wins and the losses would have us tipping like 10 cents or less for a good hand)is too much for the few times we win big. Give it a try sometime and I bet you tip more than you win in time. Really, give it a try, track your wins/losses, your tips, all the headaches tracking that count, gas to and from the casino, and then figure in the hr's it took. You will find that most AP players (over one month after all the costs)make less than you do an hr. There are a few, very few that play the high stakes games and win big.

Just be glad there are so many ploppies that view this whole gambling/losing money thing as great fun. Be glad there are people who can sit down, lose $200 to $500 over the entire night and then be so happy you shared that losing with them that they tip you the whole way. Could you lose $200 and tip another $50 on top of that? (lets be real, you would be out of a job if most people didn't lose their shirts)

You seem like a fair and helpful guy, so I thought you should know why the tipping posts get the real AP players so fired up. (and really give it a try sometime, it's an eye opener)

It's just that some AP players are so dead set against it, and then wonder why they keep getting backed off games. On the main page of this website go to 'Blackjack school lesson 12'. There it tells many ways to detect counters and what the pit looks for. Below that is a list of ways to give a good cover. Number 9 on that list actually suggests tipping a small amount when the count is high. You gotta remember that Pit managers and Floorpersons used to be dealers for years at some point (most of them anyway). They have a soft spot for seeing a bet for the dealer, yes even a small bet. A dollar is not an insult at all. You hear those stories when someone wins literally a hundred thousand dollars and throws in 2 bucks. Listen, I do appreciate anything I get, but doesn't that just sound silly.

I am on here to learn and help as everyone is, but I haven't noticed any dealers on here and its important to have an 'inside' perspective. I get the feeling that most people on here think the Pit crew is made up of greedy evil entities when, in fact, they are just people doing a job they were hired to do. Afterwards, they go drinking and partying like everybody else. They couldn't care less about the casino bottom line. That a job for the General Manager and he's rarely ever seen.

This is kinda funny, but the last General Manager's wife would blow money on the slot machines in the same casino in which her husband worked. She would lose all the time and he got mad at her for losing too much. Proof right there that the casino has no magic button to press to "change" the slots. LOL

You find all types in the casinos...

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Casino A

Pit critter "Yo Syph! I like you, and I`ve been told to tell you to leave ... and I think you know why. But my boss is a jerk, and he comes in the morning. So you can play on my shift anytime ... just make sure you`re gone in a few hours."

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Dealer: "Lets work together and both make some money"

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Casino B

Pit boss "Heh ... you know you should really be playing two hands, and I recommend you use the Ten Count...."

Syph: "Uh ... what do you mean?"

Pit boss "Son, I`ve been watching these games for 30 years. I remember when Kenny use to come here."

Syph: "Oh ... uh ...so you don`t mind if I play?"

Pit boss: "I`ve been through 2 divorces ... think I care about this shit?"

The next week Syph gets the early shuffle everytime he sits down.

Syph : "Hey, I thought you said you didn`t care?"

Pit Boss: "Ha! Ha! I don`t! Ah ... but you`re a good kid, let me get you dinner."

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Casino C

"Please step away from the table! Show me your ID! Come back here! Stop! Show me your ID!"

(Syph is followed out by security goons with cameras)

(max bet: $50)

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Dealer: "Most of our wages come from tips"

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Casino D

Pit boss: "Hey, would you like a room? Next time you come back, I`ll set you up in one of the nicer rooms, bring a girlfriend..."

(Spreading $5-100)

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Casino C (again)

Security: "We are arresting you for tresspassing!"

Syph: "Are you going to physically detain me?"

No answer ... Syph gets up and walks to the door followed by the goons with cameras (again)...

On the way out, one of the goons panics and accidentally slaps Syph`s wrist ...

"See that! See that! He hit me!" goon squeaks.

(Top bet: $16)

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Dealer "Why don`t you throw a nickel out there for me?"

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Casino E:

(Syph wins $25)

Dealer: "You obviously don`t have many friends."

Syph : "I do OK."

(Syph wins $50)

Dealer : "You see .. I also count"

Syph : "Count what?"

(Syph wins $50)

Dealer shuffles

(Syph wins $25)

Dealer shuffles

(Syph wins $25)

Dealer "...but its not working right now...."

(Syph wins $50)

Dealer shuffles.

Dealer then proceeds to rat Syph out to the pit boss who couldn`t give a damn, much to her chagrin.
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Dealer: "Remember ... the dealer is always on your side"

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Casino G

Ploppy : "You owe me $10 because I saved the table."

Syph (not missing a beat): "Ah ... but you owe me $50 for cutting the deck. So give me $40 and we`ll be square ... hey, where`s my money?"

Syph: "Give me my money!"

(note to all, attack abusive ploppies. If you are kind, it will only encourage them)

Later in the game:

Ploppy : "You are playing stupid, do as I say, and make a bet for the dealer ... you are so stupid ... what are you doing? No! No! Don`t hit! God are you stupid!)

(soft 18 v 10)

Ploppy : "I`m going to make you lose! I hope you like losing money, because I`m going to make you lose!"

Syph: "r u drunk?"

Next day: Syph sits down at the table, "Ploppy" promptly gets up and leaves.

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Dealer: "Syph, we like you, but ... some customers are good tippers, and if you anger them and they leave... maybe the dealers might not like you so much"

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Casino H:

Pit Boss : "Hey Syph, gonna clean us out again?"

Syph : "Gee ... you remember me?"

Pit Boss : "Oh yes."

Syph : "Got kinda lucky last time, huh?"

Pit Boss : "Uh huh"

(Two hours later, +$750)

Pit Boss : "When you hit $1000, I`m cutting you off."

Syph : "OK"

2 Hours later, Syph is -$1000 for the night.

Pit Boss, quite amused : "Tough game, huh?"

Syph : "Uh huh"

Pit Boss : "Let me get you breakfast."

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Casino I:

(Syph gets backed off from the dayshift, twice, playing $5-$20 ... so now plays the graveyard shifts)

Pit boss: "Oh yah, you`ll win a bit here and there ... but in the end, we`ll grind you down."

Syph : "But I am very clever"

Pit boss : "Oh, I know ... it won`t help you"

(never did get backed off on that shift, and ended up with a pretty good haul (for a red chipper) for the summer.

(Spread $5-$75.)

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Not sure if I had a point, but I can`t sleep, so I thought I`d ramble a bit.

Best,
Syph

(ps All games were single deck.)

Casino C...you did the right thing. Just walk out of the casino. The security guards are just employees, they are not the police. However, did they tell you , you couldn't come back? If not, then they can't do anything. If so, then actually, you are tresspassing, and they can detain you for it. If you refuse to be detained and walk away then you can be charged with resisting arrest and obstruction of justice. I don't know your situation on that but, even though security are just employees of the casino, they have do have a little authority in some matters because they have been trained properly by the police and work together with police.

And I`m sure they mentioned I wasn`t to step foot in their (ahem) establishment again.

Only real concern, I had, was sneaking in for their bacon and eggs special in the morning.

Best deal in town.