Seats at the table

Hello guys,

I am new on this website, I am currently living in Las Vegas but originally from France and has been a card counter since January 2014.
I got a question for you that I talk with other card counters but we disagreed, so I wanted to have your knowledgeable opinion.
Beside that being seated in the last spot at the table you will have a better penetration and thus a more accurate count to take your decision, is there any other advantage to be seated somewhere on the table ?
Does the seat matter when you count cards ?

Thank you

The main advantage of sitting in the last seat, as you wrote, is that you get more of a true count. The main disadvantage is that many counters like that seat, so you may get just a little more scrutiny from the pit. Another disadvantage is that other players will blame you if you take the dealer's bust card or he otherwise beats the other players, especially if you make a move that they feel is incorrect. You can't let this bother you at all. Another advantage is that it should give you a little more time to count the cards, which will become less important as you gain experience. Personally, I like sitting in the first seat because I know I am getting the card I am "supposed to get." That cannot be rationalized intellectually because "bad" plays can both help and hurt you (it took me many years to really believe that), but it does help me psychologically. Good luck.

to the third base seat is that almost all pit people, even the ones with very little clue, know that card counters like that seat, so sitting there could draw a little extra attention. I am not saying that the pit thinks everyone at third base is a counter, but if you are displaying any other counter tendencies, this is just another one they will add to the equation.

Personally, I like the middle seat of either seat just next to the middle. I have two reasons. One is that provides for quicker get-a-ways. I play short sessions and exit aggressively on negative counts. Some places position the tables so close together that at either first of third base, you can be 'pinned' in against the next table.

My second reason is that I try to track more than one table. Sitting in the middle I have several good views of tables on both sides of me and if I don't have a straight shot, leaning up or back slightly will usually provide a clear view. If you are at either corner, you are going to have one neighboring table directly behind you, which leaves you only one possible shot at tracking a second table and you are positioned as far away from the remaining option table as possible. And if anyone is playing the other corner spot at your table, you are going to have no shot at all.

The main advantage of sitting in the last seat, as you wrote, is that you get more of a true count.

The count isn't any more true at 3rd base than 1st base for face up dealt games. The extra edge for the 3rd base "seat effect" comes from deeper effective penetration when you go to make your decision thus you get bigger possible variations in the count and thus more opportunities to make certain play deviations from basic strategy that are +EV.

That was what I meant but wrote it poorly.

Seats on the corners of the table may or may not make it easier to view the actions of the pit. Positioning yourself so you can watch the pit without having to turn your head around is nice.

I wouldn't recommend first base for beginning counters.(This is a general comment. I am not implying you are a beginner.) The action after the deal is on you first, so you have to be ready to act on your hand without the pauses in action that happen when waiting for others to play out their hands.

Middle seat on an empty table allows you the most flexibility to spread to 2 hands when others join your table.

You may have an easier time with deck estimation at certain spots on the table.

Certain seats may allow you to catch a glimpse of cards not meant to be viewed.

I don't like sitting at first base bacause it's hard to see where the dealer places the cut card in the shoe. I learned alot from Ian Andersens Burning The Tables In Las Vegas-most importantly imho is the tremendous importance of pen.

Yeah, and the casinos learned about it too. That's why you don't see deep cuts anymore.

The preachings of casino consultant Bill Zender are having an effect. Casinos make more money from the other players than they lose to card counters. Zender discusses his research in depth in his book "Casinology" and discusses the resistance of some of his clients to believe it.

There are advantages and disadvantages to every seat at the table.

1st base. Disadvantage is that you need to act immediately, so you might give off a counter tell if you pause on an obvious hand. Of course, this could play into some acts, so may or may not be a disadvantage. You could also get squeezed in and not be able to leave as quickly. Advantages are that you have a clear line of sight to the discard tray, and the rest of the table, so you don't need to do the tennis spectator thing where you turn your head from side to side as cards are dealt. You may also have a better view of the pit, which can be important. You also have more room on the table that is not easily reachable by another player so you don't have to worry as much about someone grabbing chips, etc.

Center field. Disadvantages are the opposite of the advantages listed for first base. Advantages include the ability to quickly leave the table, potentially better view of the pit and other tables, etc. This range of seats also makes it more likely that you will naturally get an empty spot right next to you in case you suddenly need to spread to two or three spots.

Third base. Marginally better penetration for playing decisions, which won't really matter much unless you are playing a deeply dealt single deck game. Some of the same advantage of first base as far as view of the table and pit. Disadvantage is increased scrutiny by other players and also the pit.

If you are hole carding, or doing anything other than counting, then there are other considerations that are much more important than those listed above.