Better for casual players to use player's cards

For those of us that I would call "casual players", that is, players (even those that are proficient at card counting) that limit their blackjack playing to when they are on vacation and play an average of no more than $300 or so per hand (like myself), I cannot escape the conclusion that it is better to use a player's card and enjoy the comp benefits than to take the "cloak-and-dagger" approach. Here is my long-winded explanation:

My experience in casinos is that they will give you, in the way of comps/credits, in the neighborhood of a whopping 0.75% of your total bets. For instance, if you play $75 per hand for 5 hours a day at blackjack, and I believe the casino assumes approximately 60 hands an hour, you are going to "earn" $168.75 in comps. Five hours a day at $75 will get you a free room at a casino like Monte Carlo or Aladdin, while $150 will get you a free room at Mandalay Bay (again, my experience - feel free to correct). Not only that, but they will often invite you back for free.

If you want to be able to keep and use those comps, you obviously cannot get barred. Here's the approach I take that works (let me know if I am too conservative): Spread 1-4 or 1-6 (rarely) with cover (I never more than double my previous bet except for blackjacks, and I rarely cut it by more than half); play at 6-deckers with a house edge of .26-.33; count-related deviations from the $1.95 plastic basic strategy card are minimal - surrender deviations (easy because most dealers don't even know the correct plays), some of the hard 12 and 13 plays and an occasional insurance ("you're due"); and I never hide my money. If I win $1,000 at a table, so be it. I lose $1,000 at a table sometimes as well. They don't treat me any worse for winning.

From the math I have seen, not many players out there could play 0.75% better than the above and not get barred. And the real beauty of the comps is they are not an "expected return"; you will get them. The only standard deviation I play with with regards to comps is the actual comp value provided, which appears to be fairly consistent, unlike my winnings/losses in Vegas.

What do you think?

I think that your approach is fine if the goal is to enjoy low cost vacations, and you enjoy vacationing in LV. With the restrictions you place on your play, I believe that you are playing to a slightly negative EV (Not considering the comp value). You are probably coming out ahead when you factor in the comp value, BUT the trip is still costing you money.

This approach will not work if your main reason for the trip is to make money. If that is the case, then minimize travel costs (not very difficult in LV) and don't worry about the hassles of comps. Take them if offered, but don't go out of your way. You should still get comped meals, and an inexpensive hotel will not cost much. You are then free to play a positive EV game and have positive EV for your overall trip (net win minus total expenses).

Personally, I do not enjoy spending time in casino's playing BJ, and would consider a break-even weekend in Vegas to be a huge waste of time. Sort of like spending 8 hours at work in an office in exchange for a free lunch. I wouldn't even consider getting on a plane unless I thought that the net positive EV per hour could beat my option of staying home and playing my local games. That is just my opinion, and I know that others take a different view.

a 0.75% return in comps is not the same as 0.75% in cash. How many free roooms do you need? One is good enough for me- and many of these do not take from comps anyway- like the offers from places like Harrahs. How many meals can you eat? I generally do not care for a long dinner- although I have had a few nice comps at Mirage Brazilian Steakhouse and buffet at Bellagio. Generally, comps at CR Subway is good enough for me- quick, no wait, and good.

0.75+% is very attainable but you do run some risk of getting booted. Skip the cover- spread 1-8,12,16, or 20 (depening on how risk tolerant of getting booted you are) at dd and 1-8,16 w/ backonging at anything negative. runs the risk of getting booted but also have a decent chance of winning a lot of money. So you go on to the next casino. I can get enough comps to meet most of my needs by playing a moderate spread (no cover) at a one selected casino. Sometimes, I can get great comps w/ a gross spread and just bad luck. I was spreading 1-20+ dd w/ moderate bet cover but no play cover lost about 10 grand and now I get offers every week.

If you want play 10% or so at a sread to get comps but blast away the other 90%. Why waste time to get rooms you do not need and meals you do not need or want.

Good thread- interesting idea about comp hustling. Ive never considered it too thoroughly, but if like the others responded, if all you want is a free vacation, then it might be alright. But if you want to make bank, it leaves much to be desired. Like Coug said, it depends on your goals. good thread